D&D 4E Help with alchemist concept in 4e

[Ashoka]

So, I have a new, inexperienced player joining my 4e campaign. He says that he wants some kind of alchemical demolitions/blaster type of character. It sounds like he's looking for something that resembles the PF Alchemist class, but that concept is one of the few that doesn't really exist in 4e.


I'm looking for some advice on how to help him create the concept he wants. I'm open to reflavouring things (for example, maybe a reflavoured Sorcerer or something?) but I'm hoping he will go with the Artificer class so that he can help with healing and maybe become the party's main healer, eventually.


So, I'm thinking of something like an Artificer with Alchemical feats and theme and PP, and maybe a homebrewed At-Will that allows him to quickly mix together some components for an attack like what's decsribed here (thanks to random internet-person SSGoW for the idea). Perhaps also giving him some sorta proficiency bonus with alchemical items or the ability to level alchemical items up to keep them useful. It seems like this would allow the character to be both an effective alchemical-combatant and a slightly less-effective healer.


I've played and DM'd 4e for a few years but I've never seen an Artificer in play and my experience using alchemical items has been that they are... underwhelming and barely useful. I really want to be able to get this player's concept into the game, so please help me with suggestions, reflavourings, homebrews, guides or whatever.


Note that the character would be coming in at level 18 (though I hope to ease the player into things by starting them at a lower level with a flat bonus so they can keep up with the enemies, and then level him up quicker until he's even with the rest of the party).


Thanks

 

[Jhaelen]

+1 for Artificer. They're a perfect fit for the concept. Alchemical items are actually not bad - but only at lower levels. Starting at level 18 will definitely be challenging for a new player, though. I haven't tried it myself, but I've seen recommendations to let a new player play an NPC first. IIRC, the DMG2 also had some rules for creating followers that could be used. Basically, just design the character like a monster, giving it a bunch of powers with an alchemical touch.

 

[darkbard]

Demolitions expert (implies Striker) plus party needs a healer (by which I assume you mean Leader) doesn't mix particularly well. But I think your instinct to start with the Artificer to fill that party role is a good start, and the rest simply can be accomplished through refluffing.

How optimized is the rest of the party? What are its other members? Have you read the Artificer handbook? (http://www.enworld.org/forum/showth...e-Artificer-Manual-(by-Zathis)&prefixid=wotc)

Really, 4E encourages refluffing to describe powers, etc. however one wishes, so perhaps the best way to approach this is to identify more clearly what the player hopes to achieve with this character, finding a base class that fulfills that role, and then reflavoring the powers, etc. to match the imagination of the player while keeping the mechanical components unchanged.

 

[The Human Target]

I'd probably multiclass or hybrid wizard/artificer.

Blaster and artificer don't go hand in hand.

Or yeah refluff a sorcerer.

 

[thanson02]

I'd probably multiclass or hybrid wizard/artificer.

Blaster and artificer don't go hand in hand.

Or yeah refluff a sorcerer.

Agree with Hybrid class Artificer and Wizard. You can also choose the Alchemist feat for the wizard and replace the ritual spellcasting.

I have a Bard in my group that has the Alchemist feat and she is constantly making things for the players. It is almost as good as having someone who specializes in making scrolls for everyone.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

I'd go with an Artificer and refluff many consumable magic items. Maybe there's a brewmaster feat or something to make those things cheaper.

 

[cimbrog]

Honestly, I think the Artificer powers work better refluffed as an Alchemist anyways. I never liked the whole "infuse power into stuff" thing. And you don't have to re-fluff too much, just say most everything is triggered by the Alchemist throwing a vial of something. This can be pretty hilarious early on, too. Imagine the first time they use Flameburst Armor (level 1 daily) on an ally:

Ally: "Ahhh! Ahhh! I'm on fire! What are you doing?!"
Alchemist: "Oh stop whining you'll be fine!"

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Another vote for alchemist...but I'd multiclass or hybridize with Warlock or Psion.

The PF Alchemist's bombs are a fairly short ranged attack. Warlocks, unlike Wizards and Sorcerers, are mid-ranged strikers. Depending on build, you'll have a Con basis for Warlock powers, and Con is a secondary stat for Alchemists.

With Psion, you get the perfect Int stat synergy. If y go Shaper Psion in particular, you'll be creating stuff on the fly with many powers, which can easily be reflavored to alchemical effects.

 

[EzekielRaiden]

Another vote for alchemist...but I'd multiclass or hybridize with Warlock or Psion.

The PF Alchemist's bombs are a fairly short ranged attack. Warlocks, unlike Wizards and Sorcerers, are mid-ranged strikers. Depending on build, you'll have a Con basis for Warlock powers, and Con is a secondary stat for Alchemists.

With Psion, you get the perfect Int stat synergy. If y go Shaper Psion in particular, you'll be creating stuff on the fly with many powers, which can easily be reflavored to alchemical effects.

I assume where you said "Alchemist" (underlined above) you meant Artificer? I only ask to make sure the OP doesn't get confused and think there is an Alchemist class in 4e, because (AFAIK) there isn't one.

In general, I agree with the overall recommendation, Artificer or Artificer mixed with another class that brings the desirable attributes. Another mix-in option, particularly if you'd like to have party-friendly explosions, would be Invoker. It would make Wisdom a priority stat, which sorta sucks, but otherwise decently covers the "blow stuff up" angle while giving a little reinforcement to the support side too. Probably still better to go Wizard. (I say "sorta sucks" because the Artificer's core stats are either Int/Wis or Int/Con, while the Invoker's are Wis/Int or Wis/Con--it's possible to make them play nice, but sadly I think the combo that fits best would want all three and that's not really possible in 4e.)

The only critique I'd give about choosing Psion or Warlock is that both of them are relatively fiddly as far as 4e classes go, the Psion especially. They have the potential to magnify the "oh god what am I doooooing" effect that jumping into a high-level character in an unfamiliar game can create.

 

[MwaO]

Yeah, I'd go Artificer. An interesting trick to look at it is getting a Disembodied Hand/Rakshasa Claw familiar, then picking up some Wands of (insert variety of spells here), then refluffling that as your bag of alchemical tricks. That lets the build pick up some Wizard options.

Another choice is to then MC Wizard and do some Wizard power swaps