MoogleEmpMog
First Post
Tomorrow, if it was a system I liked better than 3.5, or, more to the point, d20 Modern. Never if it wasn't the former, perhaps in a few years if it wasn't the latter.
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D&D 4E The Soonest You Would Purchase 4e
- Thread starter Seeker95
- Start date
Kunimatyu
First Post
If the system streamlines the bloat of classes, prestige classes, feats, and spells that is 3.5, call me interested. If it manages to simiplify overly-complex rules elements to facilitate relatively easy play from 10 to 20, call me interested. If it manages to rework spellcasting so that my new players don't run screaming from it, call me interested. If the 'classic' monsters are reworked so that they keep their flavor and basic mechanics but run more smoothly, call me interested.
I don't care when 4E comes out, just that it's good.
I don't care when 4E comes out, just that it's good.
Nyeshet
First Post
eventually - and uncertainly - chose 2009
Honestly, I may or may not buy 4e - dependent on what is and is not changed, what rules are used, etc. I didn't like the shift towards miniature based rules (such as movement in number of squares - drop the squares are you are nearly back at 2e's standards of a number representative of movement speed.) in 3.5e. If 4e furthers the miniature-style game play, then I will not buy it. 3e and 3.5e has enough material out - via third party publishers - to be good for many years to come, and due to the free SRD one does not even need to buy the core books to enjoy any of the interesting 3rd party books bought and used. I known that I never bought 3.5e PHB, DMG, or MM. I just continued with 3e until those books were released in the SRD a few months later (if I recall correctly).
Honestly, I think the SRD route has staked WotC. If they release something that is too different and that is not liked, the customers can continue with the SRD and 3rd party works. If they release something too similar then it may (once again) be called a revision (as 3.5 was) rather than a true edition change. Indeed, if it is not different enough, it may actually be a revision - version 3.75 or 3.9 or somesuch. They have to make a new version that is different enough - in the eyes of their customers - to warrant re-buying all the core books (again) and yet not too hard to learn or convert (for the sake of half-completed campaigns) - all while still being interesting / enjoyable to play.
Despite my choice, there is a real possibility that I will not buy it. The longer I play RPGs, the more I find I like systems and ideas presented in 3rd party works - system that (collectively) are quite different from what WotC typically use. I prefer skill checks or - at worse - mana point systems for magic systems. I like the idea of Weapon groups as skills rather than a set bonus that applies to all weapons. The only things I really, really like about d20 is the utility of the system: DCs are easy to determine or modify, and a single roll (d20 + ranks + ability mod +/- misc mods) determines success or failure. Granted, I would prefer 2d10 rather than 1d20, but otherwise the d20 core skill and save mechanics are quite nice: easy to learn and use, straight forward, etc.
Honestly, I may or may not buy 4e - dependent on what is and is not changed, what rules are used, etc. I didn't like the shift towards miniature based rules (such as movement in number of squares - drop the squares are you are nearly back at 2e's standards of a number representative of movement speed.) in 3.5e. If 4e furthers the miniature-style game play, then I will not buy it. 3e and 3.5e has enough material out - via third party publishers - to be good for many years to come, and due to the free SRD one does not even need to buy the core books to enjoy any of the interesting 3rd party books bought and used. I known that I never bought 3.5e PHB, DMG, or MM. I just continued with 3e until those books were released in the SRD a few months later (if I recall correctly).
Honestly, I think the SRD route has staked WotC. If they release something that is too different and that is not liked, the customers can continue with the SRD and 3rd party works. If they release something too similar then it may (once again) be called a revision (as 3.5 was) rather than a true edition change. Indeed, if it is not different enough, it may actually be a revision - version 3.75 or 3.9 or somesuch. They have to make a new version that is different enough - in the eyes of their customers - to warrant re-buying all the core books (again) and yet not too hard to learn or convert (for the sake of half-completed campaigns) - all while still being interesting / enjoyable to play.
Despite my choice, there is a real possibility that I will not buy it. The longer I play RPGs, the more I find I like systems and ideas presented in 3rd party works - system that (collectively) are quite different from what WotC typically use. I prefer skill checks or - at worse - mana point systems for magic systems. I like the idea of Weapon groups as skills rather than a set bonus that applies to all weapons. The only things I really, really like about d20 is the utility of the system: DCs are easy to determine or modify, and a single roll (d20 + ranks + ability mod +/- misc mods) determines success or failure. Granted, I would prefer 2d10 rather than 1d20, but otherwise the d20 core skill and save mechanics are quite nice: easy to learn and use, straight forward, etc.
Razz said:Dude, that's the wave of the future. It's going to happen. And please explain what you mean by "video-gamey"? Just because there're similarities between the two doesn't make D&D "video-gamey". It's simply a style some people, I should say a lot of people, enjoy in their sessions. That style should've been incorporated a long time ago, in fact. It just took over 30 years to do it.
If you know your history well, a lot of fantasy video games have their roots in D&D.
Yeah, it is happening. How slowly it's happening is kinda surprising, all things considered. I don't want to turn this thread into another what's-wrong-with-D&D rant, so suffice to say that it's just not the style of play I enjoy. Ergo, if the style of play isn't what I want, I won't be interested in 4E.
D&D has been influenced more and more by video games. It's just an observation, a statement. Some people like it, I just don't happen to. What I mean by "video gamey" is the model of character design that's unfortunately becoming more and more pervasive. The warlock could be the wizard out of Gauntlet, for example. If you were playing the game around 1997, you may recall a glut of fighters with white hair that wielded overly long katanas and materia systems for D&D. Or how about 2001-2002? How many different versions of Ronso as a PC race popped up? Maybe this has just been a phenomenon local to the different places I've lived, but I don't think that is the case.
Just because alot of video games drew source material or inspiration from D&D doesn't necessarily make the reverse a satisfying play experience. Look at the directly video game based products for D&D, such as the EverQuest RPG or Diablo. These products have a few neat tidbits but just don't ever seem to catch on in the gaming community. Their sales seem to indicate that people would rather play them behind a computer screen than a DM' screen. I'm interested in the World of Warcraft RPG, but I'd be surprised if it lasted more than a year or two.
And just for the record, I have four NES' in various states of functionality and use. I still play the NES just as much as my PS2 or Game Cube.
3.5 D&D is the best version of D&D that there has ever been. It is elegant. Utilitarian. Plays well. I have spent a lot of money buying 3.5 books. I will feel royally betrayed if they bring out a 4th edition.
I don't see what changes that they can make that would make a 4th edition more attractive. The current version is optimal. Deviation from the current version would be sub-optimal. It would not be D&D to me.
I would rather see them continue to support the current version. Changing the rules and mechanics of the game would make my current books useless. To do that without a good reason, without a pressing need would be mercenary and disrespectful of the fans, and would destroy all the goodwill that I have built up in WotC.
I will be a fan so long as they support the current version. I will feel betrayed and lose interest in the game if WotC turns it's back on my investment in them and abandons me as a customer.
I don't see what changes that they can make that would make a 4th edition more attractive. The current version is optimal. Deviation from the current version would be sub-optimal. It would not be D&D to me.
I would rather see them continue to support the current version. Changing the rules and mechanics of the game would make my current books useless. To do that without a good reason, without a pressing need would be mercenary and disrespectful of the fans, and would destroy all the goodwill that I have built up in WotC.
I will be a fan so long as they support the current version. I will feel betrayed and lose interest in the game if WotC turns it's back on my investment in them and abandons me as a customer.
As much as we enjoy the game and invest our time/money in it, we have to remember what the 4E release really depends on.
The bottom line.
WotC is a business, albeit a business run by people who love games. They'll release 4E when they feel that doing so will make them more money than continuing with 3.5. This doesn't make them a heartless corporate dictatorship, it's just the reality of doing what you do as a business. Whenever it does come out, of course I'll check it out. But there will have to be some convincing to make me want to play something other than 3.5.
I just checked out my own material I've developed for my home games- it's over 700 pages. That's over four of the 160-page sourcebooks that seem to be standard these days. There'd have to be some very good reasons for me to want to toss it and start over from scratch, and just because a new version came out isn't a good enough reason.
The bottom line.
WotC is a business, albeit a business run by people who love games. They'll release 4E when they feel that doing so will make them more money than continuing with 3.5. This doesn't make them a heartless corporate dictatorship, it's just the reality of doing what you do as a business. Whenever it does come out, of course I'll check it out. But there will have to be some convincing to make me want to play something other than 3.5.
I just checked out my own material I've developed for my home games- it's over 700 pages. That's over four of the 160-page sourcebooks that seem to be standard these days. There'd have to be some very good reasons for me to want to toss it and start over from scratch, and just because a new version came out isn't a good enough reason.
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