D&D 5E Converting Old Adventures

Gus L

Explorer
I'm slated to start DMing again in four weeks and I've run into a very odd thing. How very different 5e and AD&D are!

...

Anyways, I started converting it, and I ran into a few problems. But the most immediate one was...holy Gygax, what's with all the magic items?

...

So I'm wondering how other people have approached converting old adventures. Do you just cut out most of the magic items? Something else?
So others have discussed the magic item issue, but I think what you are running into here is two-fold.

First, and a minor issue, "Fighter's Challenge" isn't a very good adventure... it's part of the 1992 2E glut of content, and because of era and specific goal of creating a two player adventure (One Player, One Referee and One Player) it suffers and even at publication was regarded as heavy on the magic loot and filled with high difficulty encounters (and combat focused as tends to be the nature of post 1985 or so D&D). Plus yeah, in early editions character power and advancement is much more dependent magic item recovery. So more items abound.

Second, and the bigger difficulty is that 5th Edition D&D and the editions that came before it are different games. The focus is on different play styles, goals, and player expectations. It's not impossible to play 1E adventures with 5E rules ... but it's a lot of work and demands copious adaption to either/both rules and adventure. 5E adventure is generally structured around scenes and encounters while early editions (especially the earliest) are location based exploration adventures (even more at low levels). That is a room by room delves where navigating a large map and conserving character resources by finding an optimal path through and around encounters, obstacles and puzzles while recovering treasure is the main focus. In many older adventures the players seek to trivialize and skip many combat encounters and are the goals tend to be less clearly defined. Etc. I know you've heard this stuff before ... but it really does effect the way adventures are designed.
 

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cbwjm

Seb-wejem
I've run a number of old adventures with tons of loot and one of the things I do is to not remove them. Other than adjusting some bonuses I keep everything in the adventure, creating the item if needed. I have a 4th level adventurer wandering around with a crown that grants them a continuous protection from evil.

Basically, these old adventures have tons of loot and I say, embrace it and have fun with it.
 


James Gasik

We don't talk about Pun-Pun
Supporter
I've run a number of old adventures with tons of loot and one of the things I do is to not remove them. Other than adjusting some bonuses I keep everything in the adventure, creating the item if needed. I have a 4th level adventurer wandering around with a crown that grants them a continuous protection from evil.

Basically, these old adventures have tons of loot and I say, embrace it and have fun with it.
I vaguely recall an adventure with a crown that granted protection from evil in a stupidly large radius that protected an entire kingdom, is that the one you're talking about?

The main reason I want to limit magic items is mostly because I don't want a bunch of extraneous items sitting around because nobody can or wants to attune to them. I saw that in the game I was playing, quite a few items I ask "hey, does anyone want...?" and a lot of the time the answer is "eh", so the party stash has at least a dozen items laying around.

Though I think I have a potential cure for that if the party wants to use hirelings- gearing up one's hirelings is always a possibility!
 

cbwjm

Seb-wejem
I vaguely recall an adventure with a crown that granted protection from evil in a stupidly large radius that protected an entire kingdom, is that the one you're talking about?

The main reason I want to limit magic items is mostly because I don't want a bunch of extraneous items sitting around because nobody can or wants to attune to them. I saw that in the game I was playing, quite a few items I ask "hey, does anyone want...?" and a lot of the time the answer is "eh", so the party stash has at least a dozen items laying around.

Though I think I have a potential cure for that if the party wants to use hirelings- gearing up one's hirelings is always a possibility!
I'm fine with the party stash, though I also let players convert items to gold in town.

The crown was a personal prot. Evil, not a kingdom level one.
 

I generally try to tune magic item distribution to things that players can make good use of, without being too obvious about it. There is not much point in filling adventures with hoards of junk that will never be used. I find my players are also largely disinterested in financial rewards of any kind, so it really doesn't matter if the gold is 100 gp or a million gp. The reaction is equally meh.
 

Li Shenron

Legend
So I'm wondering how other people have approached converting old adventures. Do you just cut out most of the magic items? Something else?

I usually keep most magic items, skipping only the boring ones (the flat +Xs). I adjust the magic items when their rules really don't fit the edition, but I certainly don't restrict myself to DMG-standard magic items, so even older-editions magic items with unusual properties are totally fine for me. If a magic item worries me as too powerful, I tone it down, but I also don't mind trying it out as-is and then remove some of its powers later if too much, using some narrative trick.
 

Meech17

Adventurer
I've been reading a lot of Dungeon Magazine and mining it for ideas. I've found that it's best to try not to re-create it 1 for 1, and instead use it as a basic outline. Take the plot, the interesting encounters, cool settings, and other parts that really stick out, but then re-work the rest from the ground up.

Re: Loot. A lot of these old adventures just SHOWER the party in gold and magic. Like many others suggested, I just trim it down. I try to limit the number of +# items/weapons the players get as that's just book keeping and can be tedious. I've also cut back on gold. I want money to be meaningful.. At least for a little while. If I had been following the modules/adventures to the letter my PCs would probably all have 200-500gp by this point.. I think they have less than 100gp combined at this point. The ranger really wants to upgrade to studded leather but it's been out of his grasp thus far. When he finally gets a set that extra AC point will have felt well earned, I think. Usually I roll for coin. d4 gold, d8 silver, d12 copper. I can scale the die up and down if I want to give them more or less.

On the flip side I'm pretty generous with magic items. I've taken the Baldur's Gate 3 approach and I like gluing spells onto items. 1x/day spider climb on a pair of gloves or whatever.

Second, and the bigger difficulty is that 5th Edition D&D and the editions that came before it are different games. The focus is on different play styles, goals, and player expectations. It's not impossible to play 1E adventures with 5E rules ... but it's a lot of work and demands copious adaption to either/both rules and adventure. 5E adventure is generally structured around scenes and encounters while early editions (especially the earliest) are location based exploration adventures (even more at low levels). That is a room by room delves where navigating a large map and conserving character resources by finding an optimal path through and around encounters, obstacles and puzzles while recovering treasure is the main focus. In many older adventures the players seek to trivialize and skip many combat encounters and are the goals tend to be less clearly defined. Etc. I know you've heard this stuff before ... but it really does effect the way adventures are designed.
This is something else. Adventures are just different now. I feel like many of these old modules you spend 90% of the time in combat encounters, where as in most of my sessions we have one or two combat encounters. It's part of the game still, but it's no longer the core part of the game.

So when 'converting' old adventures I often re-do dungeon maps to make them shorter and more concise. Usually cutting a lot of rooms to do so. I also try to make them more consistent with the story the adventure is trying to tell. Why would the temple have a dungeon under it? Who built it? Who cares for it?

Also.. Windows. "You enter a cabin with no windows. It's lit by torches and full of smoke and haze.. Rooms unlit by torches are dark, and will require you to carry a lantern or have dark vision."... What? Why would these giants live like this Mr. Perkins? You really don't want players to be able to climb in and out of windows that badly?
 

Warpiglet-7

Cry havoc! And let slip the pigs of war!
The problem for me is that I don’t care much anymore.

There are so many abilities and spells and infusions and invocations and…you get the point…

Magic items and gold have sort of lost their luster. I am primarily a 1e/5e guy but I just accept they are different…and that may reflect treasure hoards.

I don’t find 5e at its base to be hard to survive and as a result don’t care if people have a lot of items and even more than the game assumes.

If I play how I want to play, the DM has to turn up the heat anyway
 

Gus L

Explorer
This is something else. Adventures are just different now. I feel like many of these old modules you spend 90% of the time in combat encounters, where as in most of my sessions we have one or two combat encounters. It's part of the game still, but it's no longer the core part of the game.
So I think this may be a misconception. Though a lot depends on the adventure and the edition. Certainly it's true that some of the later 1E, most 2E - 4E adventures often have a combat focus, early 1E and prior adventures, which are the ones that generally get praised and talked about, aren't especially combat-centric. Oddly perhaps one of the critiques of contemporary adventures in the old-school scene is that they only have combat encounters.

I think this happens because in early adventures all encounters are described with stats and the tools you'd need to make them combat encounters, and you have a system that doesn't have many mechanics for social interactions. Yet, a few things work to make it so that many of these encounters won't be resolved through combat (for some people they will - but it tends to lead to dead PCs fairly quickly).
A) Reaction Rolls: Prior to approximately BECMI, the assumption is that the referee will roll for the reaction from almost any monster or NPC encountered. Usually a 2D6 with only a 2 being immediate attack. Other creatures tend to warn the party off, threaten them, or demand something rather then attacking immediately. This means that it's fairly rare that a combat doesn't start with the PCs decision to engage in it (well 2 in 6 surprise ... so it's complex).
B) Morale Rolls: Morale means combats tend to be shorter, and if one is fully engaging with the mechanics can be pushed towards the enemy fleeing or surrendering with things like impressive displays of magic or trickery.
C) Schemes and Skullduggery: There is an aspect of older play (or perhaps just OSR play - but I think it starts early) of evading, tricking and assassinating monsters - or otherwise throwing things into the party's favor so that they can face the minimal combat risk. This means leading monsters into other monsters, using faction rivalries in the dungeon to gain allies, setting traps, using illusions or other lures, finding good ambush spots or simply bribing monsters.

Of course none of this tends to be in the older adventures explicitly. It looks like a constant battle, because these are not highly supported by mechanics. Instead we have only the play reports and table culture of old games as well as some indications of how scoring in AD&D tournament modules worked. For example the version provided in the A series of tournament modules is based on how many regions of the adventure the party completes, how many PCs survive, and some bonus points for clever listed schemes. These are not individual rooms, but areas of the adventure, so the best tactic is to move through them without too much combat.

Now, if converting these adventures, it makes sense to say "So What?" I think overall you are right to shorten the map, reduce number of encounters and otherwise simplify for 5E - because as I mention, it's aimed at being a different sort of different game. I would characterize 5E's intended playstyle as cinematic heroic adventure, 1E isn't that - its characters are anything from game pieces to nefarious schemers and opportunists (they can also be heroes - sometimes all three at once), its adventures are picaresque and its focus is on outthinking and unpuzzling the obstacles of the game world -- a playstyle that at least partially evolved from the mechanics, rather then from the long history of the genre. Late 1E-3E and 3.5-4E have their own play styles, goals, and mechanics/rules as well, but the point is still that each game and its adventures can only really work well for it unless modified. Understanding how the rule sets and play cultures function for both the game being played and the adventure being adapted is useful here. Tricky I think but useful. Like I don't know how to write a great 5E adventure. I ran a game for a year, but my efforts floundered because my expectations were too deeply rooted in OD&D and I ended up fighting the system mostly.
 

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