D&D 4E What do people think of Shadowrun 4e?

[cignus_pfaccari]

I picked up my copy last Thursday (FINALLY!), and I rather like it. It hangs together really well, and I like a lot of the changes they've made.

For example, I rather like the way they handled attribute penalties. Instead of taking them off the top, it limits the max you can have. So, for example, it costs the same for a human and a troll to have a Charisma of 3; however, it costs the troll a lot more to get a Charisma of 4 (55 Build Points, as opposed to the 40 Build Points).

Another thing I like is how they've rationalized Bioware and Cyberware. They wind up doing pretty much the same thing, and are available in the same grades, but cyberware is much less expensive, but costs more Essence. For example, Wired Reflexes-3 has the same effect as Synaptic Accelerator-3, but costs 100k and 5 Essence as opposed to the Synaptic Accelerator's 240k and 1.5 Essence. Also, cyberware is much more detectable than bioware.

It just seems more...complete...than the previous editions. Like, for example, it has rules for site security and athletics, both of which had to wait for supplements for any real detail.

I'm quite happy. Thoughts?

Brad

 

[Starman]

I've been slowly reading through my copy. I'm really pleased with it. The streamlined mechanics are worth it by themselves. It seems like a lot of things have been cleaned up and simplified. Before, I liked the game primarily for the setting. Now, I think I'll enjoy the setting and the mechanics.

 

[Shard O'Glase]

not entirely sure. It has tons of ambiguity in the rules, so after the errata my opinion may change.

I like it overall at the moment though I dislike some things. I don't like the skill cap, I'm not sure if the adept ability enhanced ability applie sot the modifed skill cap if it does, lame. Spirits need a big rewrite, reaction x 4 on a air spirit!!

They brought back generalized skills as skill groups, no mor ejus tpistols, I can take firearms, great.

Cyberlimbs were improved, but still suck, which well sucks.

Cyber in general sucks, its only benefit is its cheaper, but otherwise it blows. For exmaple wired reflexes 2 and synaptic booster provide the same exact bonuses of +2 reaction, +2 initiative passes(2 more actions per turn). Wired costs 32,000 and 3 essence, synaptic costs 160,000(lots more) but only 1 essense. You can always get mote money, but you have a toal of 6 essense period. Sur eif you dont got the money you dont got the money, but you'd have to be crack addled in some cases to take the cyber. I find that unfortunate since I think cyber is a better theme element than bioware is.

Also the bioware in the case of the synaptic booster is so cheap essence wise physical adpets might be wise to go with it instead of using there magic.

Also the stats don't seem particularly balanced, this may not be a big thing but the races can get dramatic ability mods. Agility for example has basically every single combat(except dodge) skill in the game linked to it and plus a whole lot more. Not to worried about the lack of skills in Body since at its core it provides a lot, it being your damage resistance stat, but strength gets virtually no skills linked to it, and it provides very little outside of skills. Yeah base HtH damage is 1/2 str and it lets you know how much you can lift.

So yeah I got gripes, but tis a solid system overall even with its quirks for things like firing into a melee being a more simple task than just normally shooting someone. I didn't like the way 3rd edition went, and this is a definite improvement IMO.

 

[Drowbane]

So eh... when is Shadowrun d20 coming out?

I love the Setting of Shadowrun... but the mechanics have always kinda sucked. I mean, you get screwed for being really really good at something... bleh!

 

[Altalazar]

So eh... when is Shadowrun d20 coming out?

I love the Setting of Shadowrun... but the mechanics have always kinda sucked. I mean, you get screwed for being really really good at something... bleh!

Part of Shadowrun's charm is the mechanics - I like rolling a ton of 6 siders. I like that it is a totally different system than D&D (and of course d20). It is part of the feel of it for me. I'm going to have to pick up the latest edition. I was somewhat skeptical when I heard it was coming, especially after I heard they were messing with the whole world, but maybe it was for the best as far as RP goes. But I'll always have a soft spot for the original.

 

[Chaldfont]

Fixed target numbers rock. It greatly simplifies the game.

 

[Hitokiri]

Wow. I wasn't going to pick up the new edition because of the horrid game mechanics and bok layout from the past two editions, but now I just might. I've always loved the setting, but the game mechanics needed to be streamlined badly.

One question, what have they done for decking? The previous editions rules made it annoyingly slow. You couldn't effectively have a decker overseeing your run in a lot of cases because it slowed the game down. Any improvement in this area?

 

[IcyCool]

So eh... when is Shadowrun d20 coming out?

I love the Setting of Shadowrun... but the mechanics have always kinda sucked. I mean, you get screwed for being really really good at something... bleh!

Screwed for being really really good at something? How?

 

[Shard O'Glase]

Wow. I wasn't going to pick up the new edition because of the horrid game mechanics and bok layout from the past two editions, but now I just might. I've always loved the setting, but the game mechanics needed to be streamlined badly.

One question, what have they done for decking? The previous editions rules made it annoyingly slow. You couldn't effectively have a decker overseeing your run in a lot of cases because it slowed the game down. Any improvement in this area?

supposedly yes, I haven't gotton through that section yet so I can't say. As I understand it the decker will have more in combat with the team hacking experiences. everything is wirless and he might for exmaple in the middle of a gun fight in a wharehouse hack the cameras in the place and give his team the location of all the foes which will appear on all there hud displys through things like there sunglasses.(an example in the opening short story.) He can apparently do this quickly in a initiative pass or two.

 

[Drowbane]

Screwed for being really really good at something? How?

Keep in mind that I haven't looked at SR 4e... but in every other version of the game...

Shadowrun had this lovely little mechanic where if you rolled more 1s than successes, you botched. White Wolf did the same thing. Anyways, the odds of rolling more successes than 1s with a high pool of dice is ridiculously hard... at least for me. Nothing like being a Phys-Ad with sick combat stats... and getting tooled by some generic gangers because the mechanics hose me for being a badass.

Did I mention I *love* the setting itself?