First Level Powers at Epic Levels?

[Patlin]

The Rogue article shows us that some first level attack powers scale up at epic levels. I find this a little surprising, as I would have expected that 20 levels later first level at will powers would either be replaced or irrelevant. Even if still available for use, surely you would have something better by then?

It also makes me curious as to the structure of gaining powers. I had the impression that they wanted to keep the number of powers limited. They did state, for example, that creating a high level character wouldn't take much longer than creating a low level character.

So how will it work?

1) A power once yours is yours forever.
2) You gain new powers and occasionally upgrade some lower level powers (a la book of nine swords.)
3) Each level up you re-choose all of your powers.

 

[Kahoots]

I always thought that you would receive a feat on one level and a power on the next. It's interesting that (at least some) powers upgrade at higher levels. WOTC seems to be wanting to give players options at the higher levels instead of using their one "good move" ad noseum.

 

[hafrogman]

So how will it work?

1) A power once yours is yours forever.
2) You gain new powers and occasionally upgrade some lower level powers (a la book of nine swords.)
3) Each level up you re-choose all of your powers.

I expect (hope?) that it will be mostly 2. So every rogue sneak attacks at the progression given. A trickster rogue might gain a later power that gives new ways to get combat advantage (improved feint) while a more thuggish rogue could gain the power to sneak attack with weapons other than those listed in the initial power.

Base powers to start, later powers could modify the base in different ways.

 

[helium3]

So how will it work?

1) A power once yours is yours forever.
2) You gain new powers and occasionally upgrade some lower level powers (a la book of nine swords.)
3) Each level up you re-choose all of your powers.

I suspect the truth is closest to choice number two, as that seems pretty consistent with the idea of retraining that they've been introducing over the last few years. As near as I can tell, the ability to change decisions you made at earlier levels is pretty radical for D&D.

 

[FitzTheRuke]

They have mentioned retraining so I expect you WILL be able to swap-out powers & feats you feel are no longer effective, but I think you will continue to add new ones as you advance. I don't think the rate is super-fast though, and you may only get new dailies every, say, 4 levels or so.

Anyone want to guess how many total at-will, encounter, and daily powers a 30th level character will have?

Fitz

 

[FitzTheRuke]

Also, keep in mind (as evidenced by the rogue Tumble power) not all powers are attacks, or even standard actions, so even if you had, say, 24 powers, the combinations of which would keep things interesting.

And some would only be good in certain situations, so it's not like you'd have to peruse all 24 every round to decide what you want to do. (Not to mention that if you actually PLAYED that far as opposed to jumped levels you'd be pretty familiar with them all.)

Fitz

 

[AllisterH]

The Rogue article shows us that some first level attack powers scale up at epic levels. I find this a little surprising, as I would have expected that 20 levels later first level at will powers would either be replaced or irrelevant. Even if still available for use, surely you would have something better by then?

<snip>

2) You gain new powers and occasionally upgrade some lower level powers (a la book of nine swords.)

I think this is the way it is going to be and that the powers are going to be like the manoeuvers of Bo9S.

For example, Countercharge is a 1st level power that is useful at ALL levels while from the same school, you have the "X Throw" manoeuvers which obviously are meant to be replaced by the higher level manoeuver on the chain.

 

[Dragonblade]

Personally, I like the notion that powers scale. So that my 1st level powers are as useful at Epic levels as they are at Heroic. That is a fantastic idea.

They have also said there are retraining options in the rules, so you should be able to swap out powers you don't like anymore.

 

[Voss]

Hopefully its one.
A power is yours forever and hopefully it scales.
If it doesn't scale, the system gets a Fail! sticker.

Retraining rules should be driven off with bats and a multitude of curses.

 

[kennew142]

Hopefully its one.
A power is yours forever and hopefully it scales.
If it doesn't scale, the system gets a Fail! sticker.

Retraining rules should be driven off with bats and a multitude of curses.

I have always allowed players to change their character's build. IMO forcing someone to play bad choices for the life of the character is a bad idea.

I fail to see why you would wish to remove the retraining option from the rules just because you don't like them. Other gamers have different tastes. Why should they have to play according to your tastes.