D&D 5E Encounter Building: Revised XP Threshold by Character Level Table

[Edwin Suijkerbuijk]

When it comes to encounter designs I think we should look at the multiplyer for multiple monsters first.
as this seems to realy ramp up the adjusted XP.

if you have a Cr 20 dragon and add one cr 1/8 kobold the encounter does not become 1.5 times as hard.

 

[discosoc]

I've been running almost nothing but hard and deadly fights per the DMG xp assessments, and I've had a few drop to 0, but no deaths. It does seem like they're a little on the easy side.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I think the default rules are pretty accurate until about level 8 or so. It just breaks down significantly after that. Plus, some encounters are changed depending on initiative order. A deadly encounter where the enemy goes last is more like a medium encounter, in my experience.

I personally don't have a problem with the system, but I'm also used to building encounters from 2nd edition, where you really had nothing to go on, and just had to look at damage output for both sides within the context of your planned location. The bigger problem I have with 5e encounter building is the default assumption that groups should be plowing through 6 to 8 of them per day.

Because the encounter system does completely break if you are running less than 6 encounters per long rest.

 

[dave2008]

When it comes to encounter designs I think we should look at the multiplyer for multiple monsters first.
as this seems to realy ramp up the adjusted XP.

if you have a Cr 20 dragon and add one cr 1/8 kobold the encounter does not become 1.5 times as hard.

That's a good point too. To be honest, what I am looking at now is a party of 4 vs 1 monster and a party of 4 vs 4 monsters. Then we would need to tweak the monster multipliers. They really should have a CR delta threshold of some type.

 

[discosoc]

But the DMG doesn't give any percentages. Party of 4 against their 4 clones is going to be a 50/50 shot of a tpk. I think that's a little beyond deadly. Deadly, from my interpretation of he DMG guidelines, means 1 or 2 of the PCs might die, not the whole party.

Hard encounters are listed as having the possibility of things going badly, and with a slim chance that one or more might die.

Deadly encounters are listed as possibly being lethal for "one or more characters." To me, a 50/50 chance of TPK seems to fit a deadly encounter quite nicely, regardless of party size.

Now if you interpret "one or more" to mean "one or two," then I can see where you're coming from. I just think "one or more" implies possibly more than two -- maybe even everyone.

 

[dave2008]

I think the default rules are pretty accurate until about level 8 or so.

That's good to know and supports some earlier comments. I plan to revise the table to take this into account.

The bigger problem I have with 5e encounter building is the default assumption that groups should be plowing through 6 to 8 of them per day.

Yes, the revised guidelines i'm working on would include recommendations for fewer combats per adventure day. Really it is all about the number of easy/medium/hard/deadly encounters that should determine the number of encounters per day.

 

[Matrix Sorcica]

That's a good point too. To be honest, what I am looking at now is a party of 4 vs 1 monster and a party of 4 vs 4 monsters. Then we would need to tweak the monster multipliers. They really should have a CR delta threshold of some type.

The DMG mentions that low CR monsters shouldn't count when in high CR encounters.

 

[dave2008]

The DMG mentions that low CR monsters shouldn't count when in high CR encounters.

Does it specify the delta though? At what point is it considered low compared to a CR 23 Kraken for example.

 

[Matrix Sorcica]

When making this calculation, don't count any monsters whose challenge rating is significantly lower than the average challenge rating of the other monsters in the group unless you think the weak monsters significantly contribute to the difficulty of the encounter.

 

[dave2008]

When making this calculation, don't count any monsters whose challenge rating is significantly lower than the average challenge rating of the other monsters in the group unless you think the weak monsters significantly contribute to the difficulty of the encounter.

Yep. I would like to see this guide as foot note to actual recommendations. That is what I plan on doing at least.

 

[Edwin Suijkerbuijk]

Does it specify the delta though? At what point is it considered low compared to a CR 23 Kraken for example.

wel I think you shoulden't compare it to another CR but the level of the party.
I think the low range would start at party level -4