Effectiveness of riot shields for medieval type fighting

[tomBitonti]

Hi,

I was looking at images of polycarbonate circular riot shields, for example:

https://www.google.com/search?q=tra...LAhVMXB4KHY0CCLkQsAQIGw#imgrc=kyBR_wlYYJWqEM:

http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/The-PC-circular-riot-shield-shield_1382457391.html

And I was wondering how effective these would be for medieval type fights. They would seem to be decent enough protection against swords and arrows. Are they able to withstand blunt impacts, such as from heavy maces?

The per unit cost from China is about $15.50 per unit, which is amazingly low.

A downside seems to be edge protection: These have unprotected edges, which seems problematic. That would be easy to remedy with a simple metal trim.

Thx!
TomB

 

[Joker]

I don't know if I would trust the durability of a riot shield made in China.

 

[MarkB]

Check the warranty. See whether it covers swords, maces and halberds.

 

[tomBitonti]

Check the warranty. See whether it covers swords, maces and halberds.

We do have this:

Technical parameters:
Specification: 550 * 500 * 3.0/3.5mm;
Material: manufacturing high quality transparent polycarbonate material PC;
Transmittance: 84%;
The impact strength of 248J kinetic impactor meet standards;
Puncture resistance: Standard Test Tool GA68-2003 20J kinetic energy puncture standard;
Grip: connection strength ≥ 500N;
The arm with the connection strength: ≥ 500N;
Net weight: 2.3kg

I imagine the rating is for bullet impacts.

Thx!
TomB

 

[Ryujin]

Something as small as a 9mm Parabellum round has 400+ Joules of energy. Depending upon the load perhaps 600+ Joules. It's not going to stop a bullet. For that you would be looking at something more than a half inch in thickness, which would essentially be unusable for the intended purpose. A PC riot shield is mean to protect against bludgeons and improvised weapons, bricks, rocks, bottles.... That sort of thing.

 

[Umbran]

I want to talk to one of my friends who fights more regularly sword-and-board, but my first thought is that being that lightweight is not actually a good thing for medieval-style combat.

A shield is most certainly supposed to stop a weapon, however, it only does so if it is in place. A heavy shield doesn't let a weapon through, but it *also* absorbs a lot of momentum, meaning that when it gets hit, it *stays put*. A lightweight shield doesn't absorb momentum well - it either transfers the momentum to you, or it *moves* forcing you to quickly apply muscle power to keep it in place.

Which means, against someone who knows what they are doing, the first shot will knock your shield aside (or down, or otherwise out of the way), and the next one will hit you. Or, if it is something big and heavy like a two-handed sword, it just gets smashed down and the blade still connects.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Exactly. Think of those riot shields as light shields or bucklers in terms of mass. The lightweight, durable material protects a bigger area of the wielder, but a sufficiently massive weapon striking it can displace it or allow some energy transfer up your arm. And hydrostatic shock ain't no joke.

However, there are higher quality ones that do a better job of energy dispersal- they're built to flex a bit.

But if they're thinking small arms fire is going to be involved, you'll see cops deploy with bigger, heavier shields with polycarbonate/lexan/whatever vision ports. THOSE are the kind I'd want if facing someone with a large maul or battleaxe.

Even so, your best bet agains that kind of weapon is angling your shield for deflection, not just stopping it like a wall. Again, you don't want that energy traveling up your arm.

When I was sparring in NERO- one of those bopper fighting organizations- I often fought against a guy who was a bouncer: 6'3", 330 lbs of meat. He preferred 2 weapon style, and he was good at it. I went after him with a 6' "polearm"- the last 2' of which were the striking head. That head weighed about 2lbs.

The first time we faced off, I had the base of the thing's haft at shoulder height, so the head was 11' in the air. When I brought it down, he tried to simply catch it with crossed swords...and the striking head collapsed his defense right into his noggin. Damn near concussed him. As big and powerful as he was, the only way he could counter that strike was to deflect it.

 

[Janx]

can we back up a step and ask Tom what he plans to do with this riot shield?

 

[Umbran]

The first time we faced off, I had the base of the thing's haft at shoulder height, so the head was 11' in the air.

I sure as heck hope you were standing behind someone, because your entire body must have been open.

When I brought it down, he tried to simply catch it with crossed swords...and the striking head collapsed his defense right into his noggin. Damn near concussed him.

Which is why the head is not a legal target in NERO.

 

[Janx]

I sure as heck hope you were standing behind someone, because your entire body must have been open.

granted, at 11' in the air, that meant the destined target was 10-11' away, so being wide open was less of a risk at that range, than say much closer.

We sparred a friend with boffers, who'd had some SCA big sword fighting training, and the technique was similar. Blade up, ready to do a rapid levering on the pommel. Packed quite a wallop. on the head.

Had to ask him not to do that, as the risk of head injury and damage to the weapons (that was quite a bit of force) trumped realism of learning to deal with the technique.

Which is why the head is not a legal target in NERO.

Danny wasn't a lawyer back then?