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D&D causes murder/suicide?

SemperJase

First Post
First let me say that I am a Christian. This post is not to say that Christians are bad. Some groups have legitimate complaints about D&D. I agree with their some of their facts (D&D related deaths not being in that category), I just disagree with their conclusions.

I know everyone has seen the articles claiming that D&D can lead to murder and suicide. These articles all list the same 12 deaths cases with the most recent being in 1988. I also know that we all disagree with the claims, but I have never seen any referenced analysis supporting our rebuttal. So here is mine.

Wizards of the Coast market research indicates 2.8 million people play roleplaying games once a month(1). The National Institute of Mental Health claims that the suicide rate (as of 1998, the most current figure) is .01% (2). I would argue that education does not effect suicide rates and introverts (as roleplayers are branded) are more likely to succeed in their attempts so perhaps this rate should probably be higher but we'll stick with it. The murder rate averages about 4 per 100,000 (1976-1999) for white males between 18-24 (the major roleplaying demographic) according to the Department of Justice.(3) That would indicate that at least 280 RPG players should committ suicide and 112 would committ a murder every year as a statistical norm. Yet, the anecdotal evidence doesn't even come close to approaching this over a decade, much less a single year. If these numbers are multiplied for a ten year period, you should be able to site thousands of D&D related deaths but that just isn't happening. The real murder rate for 18-24 year old, white, educated, quiet males would have to be almost zero to overcome the statistical variance of the liste of D&D related deaths.

So, that is my case. Anyone care to review that data (I know there must be some statistical types here) and respond?

(1) http://www.wizards.com/dnd/article.asp?x=dnd/br/br20010323a

(2) http://www.nimh.nih.gov/research/suifact.htm

(3) http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/homicide/tables/varstab.htm
 

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Berandor

lunatic
One thing is that not all murderers are asked whether they play D&D.
Same goes for people who commit suicide; sometimes this road is not taken.
So the statistics are flawed there.

You also gotta see what the average gamer is like, and then see whether these people might be more or less probable to commit murder or suicide.

Finally, mostly one can have a statistic to underscore each thesis.

Bwerandor
 

RogueJK

It's not "Rouge"... That's makeup.
Michael Stackpole has a very well-written article examining and dispelling the myths and rumors behind D&D. One section examines the suicide rate of D&D players and finds that it is lower than the norm.

I used to have the page bookmarked, but I can't seem to find it. Anybody have a link?

Edit: Ah, here it is. http://www.locksley.com/6696/rpgsatan.htm
 
Last edited:

Zappo

Explorer
I've read somewhere that suicide rates among RPGers are something like 10 times lower than the average. The reason being, the game promotes social relation and problem solving.
Unfortunately, I cannot give a source, since I read it years ago on a website.

Articles against D&D always cite the same 12 cases, yes, and of those 12 cases only in ONE the court did actually prove a connection to D&D. Personally, I think the murderer claimed "D&D made me do it" only so as to save his sorry a$$ from what could have been a death sentence. Even if the game really did bring him to murder... 1 case on 2.8 millions is not bad, is it?

Even if, and it's a big assumption, all those 12 cases were actually caused by D&D, we would STILL be 12 on 2.8 millions, orders of magnitude below average.

The other 11 cases are all of the "he played D&D" type. The reasoning behind is "the guy played D&D, so he commited the crime because of D&D, and definitely not because he was a druggist/was beaten by his parents/was alcoholic/etc."

Of course, this kind of reasoning luckily doesn't stand in court. No connection has been found to D&D in those cases.

This site has some very good information and rebuttals of the D&D-causes-madness theorists.

A curiosity... Pat Pulling once estimated 8% of D&Ders to be Satanists. This would make Satanism the 8th religion in the USA. When asked the source of this estimate, the answer was "I figured 4% of the young, 4% of the old, and added the two". :rolleyes:
 

SemperJase

First Post
Stackpole

I have seen Stackpole's "The Pulling Report". The problem with it is that his statistics are unreferenced.

Berandor:
I agree with your analysis. My main point is that 12 cases of murder/suicide is inappropriate as proof of a connection between D&D and these crimes. There is also no proof that D&D related murders/suicides is outside the statistical variance. Right?
 


Tsyr

Explorer
Yeah, and then when some talk host or something corrected her math, she got really defensive -while still never exactly out-and-out admitting she was wrong- with something like "Well, even _if_ my math _is_ wrong, It was a very conservative estimate."
 



Umbran

Mod Squad
Staff member
Supporter
One rebuttal might be to show how often a murder or suicide could be linked to other hobbies (say, to fights at or after baseball and soccer games).

I also recall the Stackpole article, and yes,his statistics are nto supported by reference. An arguement that you cannot follow up may be convincing to some, but not everybody.

And yes, a statistical check to see if the rate of murder and suicides among gamers is within that expected in their age group in general is appropriate.
 

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