Bull rush as part of a charge

[SlagMortar]

In reading some of the sunder thread, I came upon a question. When bull rushing as part of a charge, do you still get to make a melee attack?

I always assumed that a bull rush as part of a charge was in place of the melee attack, but perhaps that is not the case. The rules for bull rush and charge indicate it is more like drawing a weapon as part of a move with a BAB of +1 or higher.

Thanks.

 

[Hypersmurf]

...

... huh. [/Mal]

-Hyp.

 

[blargney the second]

Dude, you stumped the smurf! Gratz!
-blarg

 

[Machiavelli]

Ya know, that's a really good question!

Rephrased (though I don't think it needed it):
"Does the bullrush as part of a charge replace the melee attack, or is it in addition to the melee attack?"

 

[hong]

Dude, you stumped the smurf! Gratz!
-blarg

 

[Nail]

No way.......


What's posted above is amazing........

...I can't believe I lived to see this day.....























.....thanks, hong.

 

[Nail]

Alright, lemme try:

Bullrush may be "part of a charge". A Bull Rush does not replace part of a charge. It is just "part of a charge", implying that it's just added to whatever it is that charge does.

Charge provides for a melee attack at the end of the charge.

So.....Yes, you can Charge, Bull Rush, then attack at the end of your charge.

 

[Stalker0]

So.....Yes, you can Charge, Bull Rush, then attack at the end of your charge.

From a flavor standpoint, it also makes sense. Its the only push the opponent back, and then throw a spinkick at his face routine. It could definately make bullrushing more useful in certain circumstances.

But from the rules standpoint, its an interesting question.

 

[frankthedm]

So.....Yes, you can Charge, Bull Rush, then attack at the end of your charge.

No. you could not.

BULL RUSH
You can make a bull rush as a standard action (an attack) or as part of a charge (see Charge, below). When you make a bull rush, you attempt to push an opponent straight back instead of damaging him. You can only bull rush an opponent who is one size category larger than you, the same size, or smaller.

If somehow that is not enough for you, the moment you enter the foes space, you have gone too far to make a melee attack with a charge.

First, you must move to the closest space from which you can attack the opponent.

The window to strike on a charge closed as the charger went into the defender's space. 5' before that if the attacker had reach.

Movement During a Charge: You must move before your attack, not after.

Closes the door to Bull Rushing after the attack.

 

[Hypersmurf]

If somehow that is not enough for you, the moment you enter the foes space, you have gone too far to make a melee attack with a charge.

First, you must move to the closest space from which you can attack the opponent.

The first thing he did was move to the closest space from which he could attack his opponent. Condition satisfied.

The second thing he did was make his Bull Rush as part of the charge, by continuing in a straight line past the closest space from which he could attack his opponent, into his opponent's square.

Then he stopped moving, and we continue on to what happens after the movement - make a single melee attack.

While the charge action requires you to move to the closest space from which you can attack the opponent, it doesn't specify that you must stop there. As becomes clear, for example, in the case of a non-Improved-Grab grapple, where you move to the closest space from which you can attack your opponent, make a touch attack, and continue moving into the opponent's square...

-Hyp.