D&D 4E WotC better fix Wildshape in 4E...

[JesterPoet]

In truth, there aren't all that many forms that are attractive in any case. Realistically, how familiar is your temperate druid with the lion and rhinocerous? Not at all, and thus you can't wildshape into them.

This depends on how much downtime your character has. Remember, a druid who wants to study other animals and has the wildshape ability has an amazingly effective method of transportation. When you can shapeshift into a bird, you can really get around.

Your temperate druid could easily have visited many other lands to study animals. After all, why does he have such a high Knowledge: Nature? (Assuming he does, that is).

 

[kigmatzomat]

It is and it is. I've argued for some time now that the biggest problem with 3.x is that it really needs several strong electronic aids to play well (assuming a group really tries to follow the RAW), and those electronic aids, for the most part, don't exist. Just look at the problems with eTools.

I'd try PCGen. I ran a druid and did a quick copy/paste to convert animal forms into templates. I load a template to my PC and it resets the stats etc to that of the animal form. It auto-calculates the natural attacks et. al. Just save an equipment profile for animal forms and select it so you get all the right magical gear mods.

I believe that was added to PCGen, if not I can send you the template files. I'm in 3.0 games but I don't think the 3.5 animal stats changed.

I'm currently running a druid/wizard/mystic theurge with Augment Summoning. I've spent hours creating a spreadsheet to generate the correct stats for his creatures. A real pain.

If Augment summoning isn't a template it can be. PCGen has the animals, apply the template and print out character sheets. Save the set and you're done. You can add spells as temporary effects so you can add in buff spells to your summoned sheets.

 

[Jdvn1]

Jdvn1: Even if you can cast more buffs while Wildshaped, such as Armour of the Crocodile, it is still the buffs and not the Wildshape itself that seem to be causing you trouble.

Armor of the Crocodile is not a buff I cast. It's a class ability. Sure, you could argue the class ability is what complicates the issue, but it'd be much easier if I was just dealing with longswords. Thankfully I only have to worry about it when I choose a new animal form which isn't too often.

As for size increases, its easy to memorise the smaller ones and here's a secret formula for dealing with damage dice of larger sizes (i.e. big amounts of d6s) when the size increases. Every two increases from a power of 2 brings the dice linearly up to the next power of 2 (for instance 2d6 becomes 3d6 becomes 4d6, or 4d6 becomes 6d6 becomes 8d6, or 8d6 becomes 12d6 becomes 16d6). If you'll believe it, it wasn't Wildshaping that caused me to discover this formula. It was actually an Expansioned (for two sizes) Psychic Warrior wielding an Oversized Greatsword and using Monkey Grip to deal 8d6 base damage.

One thing I noticed is that the damage increases are different in the PHB than they are in the MM, which leads me to believe they're different for natural weapons than they are for manufactured weapons.

 

[Felon]

As a DM, next game I run, if you don't have the stat card or spell effect ready to tell me if I ask, the spell fizzles.

Then you will be a pretty poor DM indeed. A lot of spells are complicated these days. You want the wizard to have an encyclopedic knowledge of every spell's range, duration, number of targets, saving throw type, targets affected, spell components, and effect? Or, a better question, do you expect that you will have all of this information handy every time an NPC casts a spell? Sure, players need to evidence a degree of preparation, but the other players and the DM need to have a modicum of patience. Even frequently-cast spells often need to be looked up.

 

[Ogrork the Mighty]

Jdvn1: Even if you can cast more buffs while Wildshaped, such as Armour of the Crocodile, it is still the buffs and not the Wildshape itself that seem to be causing you trouble.

Ogrork: You are suggesting a new edition so that WotC can make a rule that forces people to limit their forms?

Neither of these are correct. I'm not talking about buffs at all. I'm talking about the statistical changes that must be made to creatures a druid wildshapes into. It is the wildshaping that is causing the trouble.

I never called for a new edition. Learn to read a little better. What I stated was that WotC needs to fix wildshaping in the next edition. I never put any time lines on that. It could happen in 10-15 years for all I care. What I am suggesting is that WotC comes up with some type of standardized wildshaping rules that does not require a spreadsheet, hours of prep, or intricate gaming knowledge to be able to figure out. A new player is simply NOT going to be able to do it on his/her own and will require the assistance of a more experienced player, thus eating up even MORE time. My suggestion for specific forms was just that, a suggestion. I'm sure there are plenty of other ways they can fix the problem. Heck, if they wanted to create an online electronic aid to do all the work for you, great. But we all know WotC isn't going to do that and I'm not going to waste my time fixing something that shouldn't be broken to begin with.

Wildshaping was never an issue in previous editions. Now it is. I understand the reasoning behind it and the changes make sense, but they are far too cumbersome. That's the problem.

 

[Ogrork the Mighty]

Then you will be a pretty poor DM indeed. A lot of spells are complicated these days. You want the wizard to have an encyclopedic knowledge of every spell's range, duration, number of targets, saving throw type, targets affected, spell components, and effect?

I think what he meant was having spell cards or the PH open to the spell in question upon casting. I don't think that's too onerous, especially since players generally only have one character to run and can figure out what they want to do while other people are taking their turns. Obviously, being a hardass isn't going to be positive to the gaming experience but some players need "encouragement" to be prepared.