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Wait, what? (Spell memorization in 2nd ed AD&D)
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<blockquote data-quote="Helldritch" data-source="post: 8082740" data-attributes="member: 6855114"><p> <ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul"></li> </ul><p>It also depended on the type of monsters. Daemons and demodans had a resistance tied to spell level and to the spell caster too. A 12th level caster casting magic missile against an Arcanaloth would face a resistance of 95%. If he had casted a cone of cold, the same caster would lower it to 75% (only...).</p><p></p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul"></li> </ul><p>Wrong and right. Polymorph self was an exception (as well as chape change). The survival shock was not necessary nor required for these. It was on the polymorph other that it was used. So as to avoid potential problems. I polymorph the rogue into a T-rex... abuses. The risks of dying was simply to big to take that chance.</p><p></p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul"></li> </ul><p>That is why it was so important to promote your god. To get your god to have more power would allow its cleric to weild more power too. It was also related to plane of existance where a god living on the prime could grant one more level than what he could normally would but it also meant that the same god could be killed on that plane too. A good example is Iuz.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Yes, they were often ignored. And it is in campaign that these restrictions were ignored that many games led to believe that casters were too powerful for the martial casters. So often have I seen a wizard with no spells having to rely on his wands, scrolls and staff (when he had one) that it was a shock to me when I gamed with people at the university where these restrictions had been removed. It were the same people that complained that casters were too powerful. When you have no restriction, no reason to hold back on your spell allottement you just go out and nova.</p><p></p><p>I went to DM for them to show them how it was supposed to be with restrictions on. They played their usual characters and their regular DM played mine (a paladin). They were almost killed on their second day as they went nova, and tried to rest. The wizard and cleric could not get enough rests to memorize their spells as they were forced into random encounters as per the rules. It took them three days just to get back their spells and they were not 20th level but level 10.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>You were obviously not in my games. They were there and people were applying them. The only rule I was a bit relax was encumbrance. As long as it was in a reasonable limit I could waive it.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>This is why clerics had to try to convert people to their religions. To enhance the power of their god and thus, their own. Converting people to your god was really something in my games. I had a cleric successfully raised the status of his deity from the lesser to greater god status in one of my games.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>These limits mattered a lot in my games. In fact, it was a limiting factor for the amount of demihumans in my games. A lot of demihumans would take thief as part of their multiclassing just so they could "rise" in levels after their limit was reached, as thief was the only class that was never limited (save the half-orcs that were unlimited in assassin level but limited to 8th level thieves).</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>It was about the same as in the 1ed. It was fun and just making one item required imagination. And the sacrifice 1 point of constitution was a real stopper. You would not do it unless necessary.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I certainly did. More than once and more than once per adventures. It was my way of saying: "You don't need that spells. You'll have it if you insist, but I would take "X" instead." Players would usually listened and take the advice.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Yes, and not. A lot of wizards were creating "traveling" spell book. Having a too big spell book would often be detrimental and the cost of creating an other was staggering. So wizards were often creating the travelling book with "utility" in mind.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Yes, they were seen as archaic. And it also led to the CODZILA as people were no longer remembering the limiting factors of casters were there to prevent such a thing from happening. 3.xed was a caster's dream come true. Martial classes were there only so that the casters could rise to a high level enough to be CODZILA and after that, martial were irrelevant. That is why I love 5ed. Martial got back a lot of power that casters had taken away from them as they (the casters) no longer have restrictions. It is a good compromise between spells and fighting power.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Helldritch, post: 8082740, member: 6855114"] [LIST] [/LIST] It also depended on the type of monsters. Daemons and demodans had a resistance tied to spell level and to the spell caster too. A 12th level caster casting magic missile against an Arcanaloth would face a resistance of 95%. If he had casted a cone of cold, the same caster would lower it to 75% (only...). [LIST] [/LIST] Wrong and right. Polymorph self was an exception (as well as chape change). The survival shock was not necessary nor required for these. It was on the polymorph other that it was used. So as to avoid potential problems. I polymorph the rogue into a T-rex... abuses. The risks of dying was simply to big to take that chance. [LIST] [/LIST] That is why it was so important to promote your god. To get your god to have more power would allow its cleric to weild more power too. It was also related to plane of existance where a god living on the prime could grant one more level than what he could normally would but it also meant that the same god could be killed on that plane too. A good example is Iuz. Yes, they were often ignored. And it is in campaign that these restrictions were ignored that many games led to believe that casters were too powerful for the martial casters. So often have I seen a wizard with no spells having to rely on his wands, scrolls and staff (when he had one) that it was a shock to me when I gamed with people at the university where these restrictions had been removed. It were the same people that complained that casters were too powerful. When you have no restriction, no reason to hold back on your spell allottement you just go out and nova. I went to DM for them to show them how it was supposed to be with restrictions on. They played their usual characters and their regular DM played mine (a paladin). They were almost killed on their second day as they went nova, and tried to rest. The wizard and cleric could not get enough rests to memorize their spells as they were forced into random encounters as per the rules. It took them three days just to get back their spells and they were not 20th level but level 10. You were obviously not in my games. They were there and people were applying them. The only rule I was a bit relax was encumbrance. As long as it was in a reasonable limit I could waive it. This is why clerics had to try to convert people to their religions. To enhance the power of their god and thus, their own. Converting people to your god was really something in my games. I had a cleric successfully raised the status of his deity from the lesser to greater god status in one of my games. These limits mattered a lot in my games. In fact, it was a limiting factor for the amount of demihumans in my games. A lot of demihumans would take thief as part of their multiclassing just so they could "rise" in levels after their limit was reached, as thief was the only class that was never limited (save the half-orcs that were unlimited in assassin level but limited to 8th level thieves). It was about the same as in the 1ed. It was fun and just making one item required imagination. And the sacrifice 1 point of constitution was a real stopper. You would not do it unless necessary. I certainly did. More than once and more than once per adventures. It was my way of saying: "You don't need that spells. You'll have it if you insist, but I would take "X" instead." Players would usually listened and take the advice. Yes, and not. A lot of wizards were creating "traveling" spell book. Having a too big spell book would often be detrimental and the cost of creating an other was staggering. So wizards were often creating the travelling book with "utility" in mind. Yes, they were seen as archaic. And it also led to the CODZILA as people were no longer remembering the limiting factors of casters were there to prevent such a thing from happening. 3.xed was a caster's dream come true. Martial classes were there only so that the casters could rise to a high level enough to be CODZILA and after that, martial were irrelevant. That is why I love 5ed. Martial got back a lot of power that casters had taken away from them as they (the casters) no longer have restrictions. It is a good compromise between spells and fighting power. [/QUOTE]
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