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D&D 2E 4ed with 2ed mindset

rob626

First Post
Found this gold nugget in the 2ed DMG (combat chapter) that summarizes things for my DM style nicely:

"Too many rules slow down play (taking away from the real adventure)and restrict imagination.

"To have the most fun plaing the AD&D game, don'r rely only on the rules. Like so much in a good role-playing adventure, combat is a drama, a staged play. The DM is both the playwright and the director, creating a theatrical combat.

"The trick to making combat vivid is to be less concerned with the rules than with what is happenening at each instant of play.

"Combats should be more like, 'One orc ducks under the table jabbing at your legs with his sword. The other orc tries to make a flying tackle, but misses and sprawls to the floor in the middle of the party!' This takes description, timing, strategy, humor, and- perhaps most important of all- knowing when to use the rules and when to bend them."


The question is: How would you incorporate this concept into 4ed? I tried like crazy to do this with 3.x and it simply did not work.

The example of the orc is actually a very good one and has happened in my games a number of times. The response has consistently been: "So the orc leapt at me? Where's my AoO? He's prone now, right? He'll provoke if he tries to stand and I get a bonus to hit him!" etc etc. This absolutely killed the creativity and cinematics of fight scenes. Trying to liven things up with description would invariably come back to bite me.

The players would take advantage of any dramatic embellishments <see Flying Orc above> while they would stick with "I swing. Do I hit?", giving an advantage without buy-in to the dramatic part of the combat scene.

How would/do you encourage your players to buy in on dramatic combat? I am feeling pretty abused.
 
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hong

WotC's bitch
All I remember the 2E DMG for is astoundingly bad advice.

. . .

Anyway, marrying florid language with crunchy rules is basically a matter of setting expectations. That means clueing your players in on what you're trying to achieve, and getting them to cooperate. It's also a matter of making sure everyone knows the rules, so that you don't 1) have to stop play to look them up; 2) get blindsided when someone quotes a rule you didn't know about, thus throwing your description of the scene into disarray. It's also a matter of not penalising fancy stunts, or at least not penalising them too much. If someone says they make a flying leap at the orc, just let them. Don't get them to make a Jump check, as that sends a message that trying fancy stuff just entails more risk.
 

reff42

Explorer
generally what I do is use my language and flourish after rules are done.

to use a recent 3.5 game reference-

The grick charges you. you have reach- take your AoO (player rolls a crit, rolls max damage)

"The vile creature screeches and lunges at you, you barely have time to raise your spear that it's own weight impales the creature, it's last efforts trying to gnaw at the haft of your spear.
 

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